tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post4760322285926949314..comments2024-03-28T21:56:51.675-04:00Comments on Face to Face: The 40 Year Old Virgin: It's about the woman, not the guy, changing her waysagnostichttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12967177967469961883noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-66629782787195682272007-09-29T11:03:00.000-04:002007-09-29T11:03:00.000-04:00Unemployed men have trouble finding potential mate...Unemployed men have trouble finding potential mates? You must live on a different planet than the rest of us common mortals. There's scads of deadbeats who have gorgeous girlfriends, and tons of rich nerds who marry ugly women for lack of self-respect.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-36472464643933673642007-07-28T23:22:00.000-04:002007-07-28T23:22:00.000-04:00He is grateful to her, for instance. In Gilmartin'...<I>He is grateful to her, for instance. In Gilmartin's incredible Shyness and Love, he argues that "love-shy" men would make great partners</I><BR/><BR/>Gilmartin is a cheerleader for the love-shy because he empathizes with them. So that statement should not be taken as a neutral scientific opinion, but rather Gilmartin's desire that the love-shy be treated better.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-49347892487943308652007-07-25T15:36:00.000-04:002007-07-25T15:36:00.000-04:00Oh and Melinda Gates is another example - she's no...Oh and Melinda Gates is another example - she's nothing special to look at, but had little trouble reeling in some of the top dating prospects at Duke. No one who knew her in college was remotely surprised she landed a billionaire.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-23400740138985998752007-07-25T15:28:00.000-04:002007-07-25T15:28:00.000-04:00Anne Wojcicki is not a beautiful girl, but she has...Anne Wojcicki is not a beautiful girl, but she has dated pretty impressive, non-nerdy guys before hooking up with Brin and is very well-loved in SV. I think that marriage is more an example of how a plain woman with loads of personal charm/charisma & a captivating personality (and impressive brains when dealing with men who appreciate them, as nerds generally do) can punch above her weight in the dating arena.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-61992446330263492222007-07-25T11:41:00.000-04:002007-07-25T11:41:00.000-04:00I disagree with anonymous 17. Nerd mate choice is...I disagree with anonymous 17. Nerd mate choice is <A HREF="http://cache.valleywag.com/images/2006/04/sergey-anne.jpg" REL="nofollow">largely unaffected</A> by changes in nerd socioeconomic status. Remember, even billionaire nerds retain nerd personalities, and are probably still intimidated by hot girls.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-20996009524943248552007-07-25T11:11:00.000-04:002007-07-25T11:11:00.000-04:00Do not forget that some geeks can become millinare...Do not forget that some geeks can become millinares suddenly in today's IT age. These geeks can buy what they can not get by their personality.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-80067577545562753442007-07-24T22:07:00.000-04:002007-07-24T22:07:00.000-04:00The real discrepancy wasn't his ability to change ...The real discrepancy wasn't his ability to change his shyness, but his general kindness and openness. In real life, guys like that have a lot of hostility toward women, unless the guy is asexual, and even then sometimes.Sheila Tonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02353632937706232702noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-89875969383379120642007-07-24T22:04:00.000-04:002007-07-24T22:04:00.000-04:00Note also that Steve Carrell is 5'8 or 5'9 -- this...<I>Note also that Steve Carrell is 5'8 or 5'9 -- this combined with a shy, ambitionless personality would prevent Andy from becoming manager of pretty much anything,</I><BR/><BR/>You're thinking waaay too highly of retail management.<BR/><BR/>Half Sigma, while Indian-American parents usually prefer their girls to marry Indian, I've known a number to buck the trend. it's more important that the guy be successful. As a bonus, even reactionary conservative white guys often look pretty progressive to them.Sheila Tonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02353632937706232702noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-49131296478914736152007-07-24T20:21:00.000-04:002007-07-24T20:21:00.000-04:00And what you think, would a guy like Andy had a be...And what you think, would a guy like Andy had a better success in past (like in early 20th century) when people had different values and premarital sex was a no-no?<BR/><BR/>And how about guys like Andy in cultures like India where marriages are still arranged to some degree?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-79890446270596914242007-07-24T19:02:00.000-04:002007-07-24T19:02:00.000-04:00I like your reading of the film as a cautionary ta...I like your reading of the film as a cautionary tale for women. Of course, I doubt that's an intentional message of the film.<BR/><BR/><I>I already hear the laughs, but let's be serious: only someone with no self-respect would choose a long-term relationship with a semi-good-looking woman like Trisha, who viewed you as a dieting supplement to help her control her weight, rather than an average-looking girl who had fallen irrationally head-over-heels for you. True, Trisha would make a better casual sex partner, but remember that the movie presents her as the best choice for marriage. How could you wake up and look in the mirror every morning, knowing that your wife married you due to a mixture of self-interest and pity?</I><BR/><BR/>Women are angels, agnostic. She <I>deserves</I> marriage, no matter how terrible a partner she would realistically be. <BR/><BR/>Even if she had been messing around with badboys in her youth, this <I>cannot</I> be her fault. It was really their fault for "using" her. Or it was the fault of other men for not making themselves available as attractive alternatives to the badboys. Since women are never responsible for their sexual behavior or their choices in men, they always deserve marriage no matter what, or who, they've done.<BR/><BR/>On the other hand, Trisha seems to have a good girl personality, so it's only moderately implausible that she and Andy end up together. The "skanky" woman from the beginning is a foil for her. It is possible that, like many women, Trisha followed a short-term mating strategy in her youth, and then switched over to a long-term mating strategy when she got older.<BR/><BR/>In some ways, Andy makes a great long-term mate. He is grateful to her, for instance. In <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_G._Gilmartin" REL="nofollow">Gilmartin's</A> incredible <A HREF="http://www.love-shy.com/Gilmartin/toc.html" REL="nofollow">Shyness and Love</A>, he argues that <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love-shyness" REL="nofollow">"love-shy"</A> men would make great partners, especially since there wouldn't be much danger of them being unfaithful. In real life (as opposed to Hollywood where Andy is chased by the "skanky" girl), a guy like Andy would end up stuck with the first woman to start a relationship with him. Though I don't know why a woman would want a man who was faithful only because he was too low-status and shy to find anyone else.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-50035770222715225592007-07-24T00:19:00.000-04:002007-07-24T00:19:00.000-04:00You're a Dawn Eden/Wendy Shalit fan? Wouldn't have...You're a Dawn Eden/Wendy Shalit fan? Wouldn't have thought it. Though Udolpho's pean to Eden took me by surprise too.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-60582434578952781032007-07-24T00:05:00.000-04:002007-07-24T00:05:00.000-04:00Agnostic, few things make me want to use a single-...Agnostic, few things make me want to use a single-dose lead based anti-depressant on myself like your blog. Yet I keep reading reading.<BR/><BR/>I am a loser. At least I'm not a virgin and I have a few months before my personality gels.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-4364271895433537552007-07-23T17:28:00.000-04:002007-07-23T17:28:00.000-04:00Indian women only will marry Indian men.I (Scotch-...<I>Indian women only will marry Indian men.</I><BR/><BR/>I (Scotch-Irish) married an Indian woman (Tamil Brahmin). Met in an engineering school.<BR/><BR/>However, I don't think Indian women in general are a good pool for mail order brides for the aforementioned reasons.Jodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16470033066493529625noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-6374363530252522502007-07-23T17:17:00.000-04:002007-07-23T17:17:00.000-04:00"the Irish produce plenty of stunners to select fr..."the Irish produce plenty of stunners to select from"<BR/><BR/>As an Irishman I must disagree with this statement. The Irish mean is far below the continental, albeit marginally above the British. Mass immigration from Poland has really opened our eyes. Some say we have 'great variance', and produce Miss Universe's alongside ducklings, but I am unconvinced.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-24972119015891959072007-07-23T16:41:00.000-04:002007-07-23T16:41:00.000-04:00But yeah, like I said, the easiest solution would ...<I>But yeah, like I said, the easiest solution would have been to make Trisha a conservative, traditional American woman. Then she and Andy would both be horribly out-of-place in L.A., and you'd have a variation on *Roman Holiday* or *Lost in Translation*.</I><BR/><BR/>They wouldn't necessarily be out-of-place. For many decades, until around the 1970's, Los Angeles had a big influx of mostly conservative, often religious white migrants from the Midwest and South. It wouldn't be surprising if some remnants of this migration remain today.<BR/><BR/>Not to mention the fact that given Los Angeles' sheer size, there surely are a decent number of conservative, traditional whites in the population even if they're scarce in percentage terms.<BR/><BR/><I>Also, even though just 2% of Iran is non-Muslim, in absolute numbers that amounts to about 1.5 million. So marriageable women would probably number in the low-mid hundred-thousands.</I><BR/><BR/>And that's not counting Iranian women who are Muslim but not particularly religious. According to some sources at least one-third of the nominally Muslim women in France marry outside the religion.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-76191344060410050892007-07-23T16:20:00.000-04:002007-07-23T16:20:00.000-04:00What an odd way of criticizing a movie. The Steve ...What an odd way of criticizing a movie. The Steve Sailer school of criticism?<BR/><BR/>We can put aside for a moment the fact that it's a light comedy and just focus on the fact that it's a work of fiction. Of course plenty of fiction is about ordinary people, who fulfill the expectations you get from the longitudinal studies of which you are so enamored. We love Shakespeare and Flaubert because we see ourselves in them, because we come to understand ourselves and our relationships with others better through them.<BR/><BR/>But people are also fascinated by the outliers--the individuals who are really weird, who are outliers in your studies. Of course most people aren't like that, but we like to read or watch stories about them because they are interesting. Why, when evaluating a story about weirdos, does it bother you so much that they are statistically unlikely? That's the point--that's why someone told a story about them.<BR/><BR/>Also, your comment about the South Asian ex-girlfriend, who appears in all of one scene, being "self-centered" is bizarre. What made her appear self-centered to you?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-16991536594456023672007-07-23T14:35:00.000-04:002007-07-23T14:35:00.000-04:00good post.but:only someone with no self-respect wo...good post.<BR/><BR/>but:<BR/><I>only someone with no self-respect would choose a long-term relationship with a semi-good-looking woman like Trisha [...] rather than an average-looking girl who had fallen irrationally head-over-heels for you.</I><BR/><BR/>a man's self-respect is measured and felt in large part by how pretty he finds his wife. if we're going to calculate a husband's odds of reaching a resentment-feuled imploding point then i'd say a plain jane is more likely to instigate callous disregard than an attractive Trisha who was using him to assuage her trampled ego.<BR/>men don't mind being used by hot chicks, not even in marriage.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-60573761111965368402007-07-23T13:32:00.000-04:002007-07-23T13:32:00.000-04:00Indian women only will marry Indian men. And Irani...<I>Indian women only will marry Indian men. And Iranian women are Muslim. This makes neither a realistic option.</I><BR/><BR/>I suspect the Indian case would be pretty difficult due to the caste system and larger differences b/w Indians and Americans. But Persians aren't so foreign to the West. Also, even though just 2% of Iran is non-Muslim, in absolute numbers that amounts to about 1.5 million. So marriageable women would probably number in the low-mid hundred-thousands.<BR/><BR/>But yeah, like I said, the easiest solution would have been to make Trisha a conservative, traditional American woman. Then she and Andy would both be horribly out-of-place in L.A., and you'd have a variation on *Roman Holiday* or *Lost in Translation*.<BR/><BR/><I>Single moms with baggage or fatties are the best he can realistically do.</I><BR/><BR/>Right, but remember that the movie is not trying to be realistic so much as instructional. Even in real life, although he wouldn't find a hot urban babe looking for a trophy husband, he could easily find a non-fatty Chinese or Korean woman who valued security and stability more than excitement.<BR/><BR/>Again, there are too many easy solutions to him either getting laid or finding a wife. Why did it have to be someone like Trisha? It must be a cautionary tale to women like her.agnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12967177967469961883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-47116278155507568652007-07-23T10:48:00.000-04:002007-07-23T10:48:00.000-04:00While in real life there'd be a good chance that a...While in real life there'd be a good chance that a man like Andy would marry a MOB, the concept would be too politically incorrect to work in a movie.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-52396564112728083342007-07-23T10:38:00.000-04:002007-07-23T10:38:00.000-04:00A guy who is a virgin after 25 for religious reaso...A guy who is a virgin after 25 for religious reasons should be fine though - there are quite a few equally religious female virgins of the same age who are also part of the abstinence movement & saving themselves for marriage.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-11283493530167382007-07-23T10:26:00.000-04:002007-07-23T10:26:00.000-04:00Indian women only will marry Indian men. And Irani...Indian women only will marry Indian men. And Iranian women are Muslim. This makes neither a realistic option.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-17736195370625165222007-07-23T07:31:00.000-04:002007-07-23T07:31:00.000-04:00dude...let's remember here that beggars can't be c...dude...let's remember here that beggars can't be choosers. A guy who is a virgin in the us after, say, 25 - let alone 40 -- is a scrub who does not have many options. Single moms with baggage or fatties are the best he can realistically do. I thought the movie was fairly realistic in that he didn't get some young fox.<BR/><BR/><BR/>Ps: the reason i say 25 is that the guy would have to be a lose in us, then college, then out in the real world = three strikeouts in diff environsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com