tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post4229783289141651123..comments2024-03-28T21:56:51.675-04:00Comments on Face to Face: Under-18 girls are least likely to dig awful chick flicksagnostichttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12967177967469961883noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-44516177598773308202008-06-10T11:52:00.000-04:002008-06-10T11:52:00.000-04:00Hmm, psych vs. art as chick crack.Well, psych defi...Hmm, psych vs. art as chick crack.<BR/><BR/>Well, psych definitely has a broader appeal, but, if you find girls who are interested in the arts, which is actually quite a lot of them, art will take you deeper faster. The problem with psych talk is that it is mostly pretty general, whereas if you find a piece of art both she and you like, you have immediately established a <I>very</I> specific shared emotional experience.<BR/><BR/>(And of course a lot of artists and writers have been pretty good psychologists, which is why art and literature appeal so much to so many women.)<BR/><BR/>Trust me on this, art is a fantastic hook. I may have some trouble getting first dates during different periods of my life, but I have almost <I>never</I> been refused a second.Thursdayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13002311410445623799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-50150023227399241852008-06-09T01:24:00.000-04:002008-06-09T01:24:00.000-04:00But these movies are targeted towards adults Ah, b...<I>But these movies are targeted towards adults </I><BR/><BR/>Ah, but that raises the question -- why aren't awful movies like this targeted at younger girls? Because they don't like it.<BR/><BR/>Yeah, we know younger girls like stupid stuff too, but not schmaltzy stuff.agnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12967177967469961883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-38489447934566369982008-06-08T23:46:00.000-04:002008-06-08T23:46:00.000-04:00But these movies are targeted towards adults - und...But these movies are targeted towards adults - under 18 girls love, for example, things like Gossip Girl and other similar (book, tv, etc.) series that are aimed at them, and are in their way, awful (young) chick media that is even more materialistic, brainless, & cynical about sex & boys as the stuff enjoyed by their older counterparts.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-75089486889935407612008-06-07T16:49:00.000-04:002008-06-07T16:49:00.000-04:00Thursday--Your comment is spot on.I am an "arty" g...Thursday--Your comment is spot on.<BR/><BR/>I am an "arty" girl and while I hit the clubs to dance with my friends (I am a dancer and find joy in dancing anywhere), generally you will not find that kind of girl in abundance at the club.<BR/><BR/>I love to talk about the passion behind art and lit and film and music and philosophy with someone equally as into it as I am. <BR/><BR/>I find that incredibly sexy in a guy and on a date. <BR/><BR/>I love Bach though but your right...Chopin hits all the right notes (I know corny but I had to do it).<BR/><BR/>And I am the most knowledgeable and excited about the arts than I have ever been, now at 29...<BR/><BR/>And Agnostic--Heathers is a classic, will beat Mean girls any day.<BR/><BR/>:)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-65626063250038983262008-06-07T02:12:00.000-04:002008-06-07T02:12:00.000-04:00I'll second women's preference for Chopin over Bac...I'll second women's preference for Chopin over Bach. Makes me sad, really...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-56236199996216948262008-06-06T21:42:00.000-04:002008-06-06T21:42:00.000-04:00BTW, talking about psychology is way better chick ...BTW, talking about psychology is way better chick bait than art-chat -- hence the appeal of palm-reading, astrology, etc., to girls. It's better than that, though, since if you know the lit, you will have real things to discuss, rather than superstition.<BR/><BR/>Again, not the psychology of visual perception or modeling how we acquire our vocabulary, but social psych and personality psych are guaranteed to push a girl's buttons.<BR/><BR/>As an added bonus of reading on these topics, you'll learn more about how to manipulate -- er, <I>persuade</I> -- others. Which, y'know, may come in handy.agnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12967177967469961883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-66412915444318659132008-06-06T20:17:00.000-04:002008-06-06T20:17:00.000-04:00Re agnostic's point talking flirtily about serious...Re agnostic's point talking flirtily about serious topics other than art. I've actually had some success talking with women about thermodynamics, especially entropy. <BR/><BR/>It seems that a lot of people have a very, very base level knowledge of it. It's romantic in a way, as long as I stay away from things lie Boltzman's constant and the math and focus on "things ending, being spread out, nothing lasting forever, energy is everything, blah, blah blah.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-39285418734170774442008-06-06T19:10:00.000-04:002008-06-06T19:10:00.000-04:00Chicks generally don't want to discuss Bach (or Ba...<I>Chicks generally don't want to discuss Bach (or Baroque music in general). But get them started on Chopin or Puccini and you are off to the races. Same with poetry; it's Keats not Donne that they love.</I><BR/><BR/>Chopin over Bach, really? I can't say I'm surprised, but since I'm not an art major who requires that high of a level of culture in my girls, I've never thought about it before.<BR/><BR/>Now, I'm all for indulging the silly tastes of girls, like preferring Madonna over Michael Jackson when it comes to popular dance music, or Mean Girls over the ballsier original Heathers. But because these topics are so mundane, it doesn't matter.<BR/><BR/>For non-art majors, higher culture doesn't seem as mundane as it must seem to those who live their lives studying it, and we couldn't tolerate girly tastes here so easily. Only art majors can not take art so seriously or intellectually.<BR/><BR/>I could see a heated debate about a mundane topic, where you're bordering on slapping her out of exasperation, leading to some steamy sex afterwards. But if it were over a more serious topic, we'd probably feel disgust and loss of respect more than anger and tension or frustration -- and that would lead to "I don't think I could sleep with someone who..." type of thoughts.agnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12967177967469961883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-12882189279238822192008-06-06T18:41:00.000-04:002008-06-06T18:41:00.000-04:00AE -- I don't know. IMDB seems to be down at the m...AE -- I don't know. IMDB seems to be down at the moment. One of the lists of bad chick flicks also has a list of chick flicks guys won't mind, so I could look at that.<BR/><BR/>Really, though, my concern is with "can they spot garbage?" I'm less interested in talking about great stuff with her, and more interested in avoiding soul-sucking conversations, since the latter is a more prevalent hazard.<BR/><BR/>Thursday -- yeah, the last movie date I went on was in 10th grade. It's fun when you're really young, and it's the first time you're alone in the dark together. Plus back then theaters didn't have stadium seating and it was easy to touch her.<BR/><BR/>Young girls definitely have their own crap, but I find it more tolerable. That's my point: if you only look at the average woman of either age, she has no level of culture, and it's a "choose your poison" situation.<BR/><BR/>As long as you're looking for an exceptional 30 year-old, why not find an exceptional 20 year-old?<BR/><BR/>Which brings us to the larger "pleasure of art chat" and making jokes about sex diffs in opera tastes -- something that only art majors suffer from. I'm glad we're having this conversation, since it reveals that what you and Michael are talking about is not some general desire to talk about art and culture, but to really get into art-chat.<BR/><BR/>No science person is like that (even psychologists), nor is any professional. I doubt most humanities people are that way -- like historians or philosophers.<BR/><BR/>Here's what it this sounds like to me:<BR/><BR/>You and a subset of arty people have read evo psych stuff, right? Well, just being able to discuss that with me wouldn't be enough. The girl would have to have really digested the material and have an understanding of the sociology of academia -- that way, she'll get my jokes about how males so rarely think about the "male-male competition" part of sexual selection because male academics have never won a fistfight, and how they always think about the "courtship of females" part of sexual selection, out of wishful thinking regarding their own sexiness.<BR/><BR/>If I used that example with less stodgy prose, flirty inflection, and some light touching, a female evolutionary anthropologist or psychologist would really respond to it. And she would need to have completed at least a few years of grad school -- so at least 25.<BR/><BR/>But do you see how provincial this concern of mine would be? You and others couldn't care less -- and you have a casual interest in the field!agnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12967177967469961883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-4960716686001208012008-06-06T13:11:00.000-04:002008-06-06T13:11:00.000-04:00I would also point out that young girls love their...I would also point out that young girls love their own kind of crap. It's different crap than the stuff older women love, but it's still crap.Thursdayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13002311410445623799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-79279665938299406942008-06-06T13:09:00.000-04:002008-06-06T13:09:00.000-04:00Michael Blowhard has some thoughts on sexy art cha...Michael Blowhard has some thoughts on sexy art chat <A HREF="http://www.2blowhards.com/archives/2007/02/gay_or_not.html" REL="nofollow">here</A>. Key quote:<BR/><BR/><I>And let's face it: There are strong reasons why straight men ought to engage with aesthetic matters. One: It's fun and rewarding. Two: Chicks dig guys who show some appreciation for beauty, pleasure, and taste. My theory about this: Chicks feel that the man who demonstrates some knowledge of, receptivity to, and enthusiasm for arty matters is someone who's likely to appreciate the full range of what a woman can be. Art=Woman, sorta. <BR/><BR/>I agree with this view myself, btw. If you can cook or play music -- even if you can merely discuss movies, books, and paintings articulately -- scoring with the ladies becomes much easier. Scoring in fact follows almost as a matter of course: Some shared arty pleasure ... Some flirtatious-appreciative flirtation / discussion ... Some connecting on aesthetic grounds ... And before you know it you're all tangled up with each other in the most delightful way. In cases like this one, what would be the point of distinguishing the aesthetic from the sexual rewards? It's about giving as well as taking, and it's all terrific.</I><BR/><BR/>I would quibble that not all girls respond to this kind of stuff. But especially not the girls who hang out in clubs. Bookstores and libraries seem to be best. (Alas, the internet has pretty much killed the record store.)Thursdayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13002311410445623799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-55114937377150332302008-06-06T12:50:00.000-04:002008-06-06T12:50:00.000-04:00I don't think you've much experienced the pleasure...I don't think you've much experienced the pleasures of conversation with a cultured woman. Having dated three music teachers and a literary translator in the past year, I happen to know something of this. <BR/><BR/>I think your problem is that you are approaching the arts from an intellectual perspective, but neglecting it as a sensual pleasure. Sharing a passion with someone is sexy. Furthermore, you wouldn't want to make flirty (or naughty) comments about a piece of art with some old guy expert. Art is a catalyst to conversation. Nor is it as much fun to explore male/female differences in taste with some old guy. Chatting about why men seem to prefer Verdi and women Puccini, for example, is a staple for any date with a musically cultured woman. Remember, art is about fun, however much cultivation it requires. Younger girls, however charming, are just too scattered to have really developed any passion for something in any depth.<BR/><BR/>I also think your own somewhat nerdy tastes in the arts mislead you, as they don't appear to much overlap with female tastes. Chicks generally don't want to discuss Bach (or Baroque music in general). But get them started on Chopin or Puccini and you are off to the races. Same with poetry; it's Keats not Donne that they love.<BR/><BR/>Finally, I should say that when discussing the arts with a woman, you don't want to go to much into the technical details. They don't care. They want passion, inspiration, wit, not analysis. You can engage her logical mind from time to time, but do this only very sparingly. Still, you need them to have read some of the same books, listened to the same music, watched the same movies.<BR/><BR/>In my experience, it is girls 26-30 who offer the best combination of girliness and experience, for this particular kind of thing. They have enough experience on their own to bring something to the conversation, but they are still open to being introduced to new stuff. Arty girls at this age also tend to be rather more unspoiled. They aren't the ones always hitting the clubs.Thursdayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13002311410445623799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-34228751704288705792008-06-06T09:41:00.000-04:002008-06-06T09:41:00.000-04:00Somewhat off topic, but movies suck as date materi...Somewhat off topic, but movies suck as date material, especially in the first three months. Remember, when you go to a movie, you are giving up control of her emotional state to someone else. <BR/><BR/>And in most theatres the seats seem designed to keep you from touching. Awful.Thursdayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13002311410445623799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-22393871498833373802008-06-06T06:43:00.000-04:002008-06-06T06:43:00.000-04:00Would the result be that much different if you jus...Would the result be that much different if you just looked at chick flicks in general, or a list of the best chick flicks? I suspect younger girls don't like the 'genre' as much as women in their twenties and thirties do.Audacious Epigonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07495507254628580077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19346366.post-34756451463480803192008-06-05T23:08:00.000-04:002008-06-05T23:08:00.000-04:00Here are the data. Title / Yes if under-18s rated ...Here are the data. Title / Yes if under-18s rated it below the female average, and if so by how much / Yes if under-18s rated it lowest of all age groups (number after Tie indicates how many groups split the tie).<BR/><BR/>The English Patient<BR/>Yes, -1.4<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>The Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood<BR/>No, +0.6<BR/><BR/>The Notebook<BR/>No, +0.6<BR/><BR/>Sweet November<BR/>Yes, -0.5<BR/>No<BR/><BR/>You've Got Mail<BR/>Yes, -0.4<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Georgia Rule<BR/>No, +0.8<BR/><BR/>Crossroads<BR/>No, +0.1<BR/><BR/>The Bridges of Madison County<BR/>Yes, -2.0<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>The Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants<BR/>No, +0.7<BR/><BR/>Fried Green Tomatoes<BR/>Yes, -2.6<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days<BR/>No, +0.6<BR/><BR/>Beaches<BR/>Yes, -0.1<BR/>Tie-2<BR/><BR/>Sleepless in Seattle<BR/>Yes, -0.5<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Dirty Dancing<BR/>Yes, -0.3<BR/>Tie-3<BR/><BR/>Steel Magnolias<BR/>Yes, -1.4<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Ghost<BR/>No, +1.1<BR/><BR/>Titanic<BR/>No, +1.1<BR/><BR/>Bridget Jones' Diary<BR/>Yes, -0.4<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Thelma & Louise<BR/>Yes, -1.1<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Pretty Woman<BR/>Yes, -0.3<BR/>Tie-2<BR/><BR/>City of Angels<BR/>Yes, -0.4<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Sixteen Candles<BR/>Yes, -0.2<BR/>No<BR/><BR/>Pretty in Pink<BR/>Yes, -0.2<BR/>No<BR/><BR/>The Cutting Edge<BR/>Yes, -0.9<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Strictly Ballroom<BR/>Yes, -2.4<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Legends of the Fall<BR/>Yes, -1.0<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Message in a Bottle<BR/>Yes, -1.9<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>Autumn in New York<BR/>Yes, -0.7<BR/>Yes<BR/><BR/>An Officer and a Gentleman<BR/>Yes, -1.2<BR/>Yesagnostichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12967177967469961883noreply@blogger.com